More Men Than Women: Do Chinese Males “Up Their Game”?

Young Chinese men hanging out in Tiananmen Square.

Young unmarried Chinese men, upping their game.

One of our commenters, Christine, saw this one coming…

The Economist recently published a short article that leads off with the following:

IMAGINE that the world consists of 20 men and 20 women, all of them heterosexual and in search of a mate. Since the numbers are even, everyone can find a partner. But what happens if you take away one man? You might not think this would make much difference. You would be wrong, argues Tim Harford, a British economist, in a book called “The Logic of Life”. With 20 women pursuing 19 men, one woman faces the prospect of spinsterhood. So she ups her game. Perhaps she dresses more seductively. Perhaps she makes an extra effort to be obliging. Somehow or other, she “steals” a man from one of her fellow women. That newly single woman then ups her game, too, to steal a man from someone else. A chain reaction ensues. Before long, every woman has to try harder, and every man can relax a little.

Appropriately, the entire piece is titled: “Sex and the single black woman: How the mass incarceration of black men hurts black women.” Go ahead and read it before you read this reaction from The Last Psychiatrist, and understand what excuse I have for this having anything to do with China.

I won’t rehash The Last Psychiatrist’s point(s)1 and will skip directly to where we piggy-back:

If a paucity of black men cause women to “up their game,” settle, and be alone; and men to assume a cavalier, non-committal posture, one might ask what happens to a society with too many men.

Apparently, not the opposite.  Why hasn’t it become true that Chinese women are protected, elevated, catered to?  That Chinese men have to “up their game” or settle?

How you react to this, whether in agreement or “wait, what?” confusion, will tell us quite a bit about you and your experiences with China2.

Did you agree, remembering Chinese people’s preferences for sons over daughters or thinking of Chinese male chauvinism, of men of means harboring multiple mistresses? Or did you pause for a moment, remembering Shanghai princesses and women demanding a house and car before agreeing to suitors and marriage?

Sex ratio by country population aged below 15. Blue represents more women, red more men than the world average of 1.06 males/female. Source: Wikipedia

Sex ratio by country population aged below 15. Blue represents more women, red more men than the world average of 1.06 males/female. Source: Wikipedia

You’ll realize by this moment that, well, you’ve now thought of both, and that both are true…but maybe the former is a bit more representative of the overall situation in China where men are slated to outnumber women by 30-35 million in 20203. Apart from bizarro mirror universes like Shanghai where the men are expected to cook, clean, and rear the children, most of China is still relatively patriarchal, where women don’t really hold up half the sky despite Mao’s communist efforts, and they’re still bullied around as second-class citizens…right?

If you’re still not sure, you’re probably right.

If you’re questioning what The Last Psychiatrist finds “apparent” about Chinese society, you’re probably not wrong.

There’s something odd about his question, isn’t there? Did you see what he did there?

Bonus

An interesting comment though — again for a moment — you might hesitate to agree that it’s true:

From an evolutionary and economic perspective, it’s been argued that women would fare best under polygamy. This allows multiple women to share the genes and resources of a single “alpha” male, instead of “settling” for the leftovers. Married men with kept women are a demonstration of the idea that half of the king is better than all of the pauper. This is the worst situation for most men, however, which is arguably why men have outlawed it.

Don’t miss the prologue either.

Photo credit: sasanf on Flickr.


  1. …which in more ways than one, always boils back down to one thing: narcissism. []
  2. …or at least those that stood out to you, which may not actually be representative of your experiences, and thus also says a lot about you with regards to what you notice and why. Fun, eh? []
  3. And Peter Hitchens is a wanker. []



47 Comments

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  1. Bin Wang

    -++2

    I just can’t get over the haircuts and the man purses. You call that “game?”

    • King Tubby

      -+-2

      Bin Wang. Haircuts and purses…..seriously. I look forward to the day when young Chinese males indulge in a bit of cross-dressing and make-up before they seriously enter the business end of life, the employment/apartment/marriage market in a white shirt and black office pants. And this is coming from someone who is a senior citizen.

      Also get the feeling that many posters don’t want to go near this particular story for various CS reasons.

    • Jones

      -+

      I dunno, guard #1 looks sharp. I bet his name tag reads “Sgt. LadyKiller”

  2. whichone

    -+

    I think…men will marry later, women earlier, increased competition leads to more choices and power for women.
    30-35 million sounds like a lot but against ~1.5 billion backdrop it’s more like 20.32 men to 19.68 women, and society isn’t actually filled by static number heterosexual people who are all determined to marry at the same time.

    Exactly zero expertise in demographic modeling/changes or social economics…so maybe it’s just alot of bull

  3. Elaine

    -++1

    I’m confused about which reaction I was supposed to have and what that’s supposed to say about me… but I’ll posit this:

    The 20 women/20 man game only works if everyone is roughly at the same economic/social class (i.e. with black women in the United States). Keeping up with the Johnson’s doesn’t happen when the Johnson’s are billionaires and you’re scraping by just above the poverty level. There was a study (in one of my sociology classes in college) that found poor urban, minority populations tend to spend their savings on ridiculous things like rims and expensive clothing mostly because they are more likely to live in areas where everyone is all roughly at the same economic strata. Poor white populations however, are more likely to live in places closer to people much richer than they, and therefore have less willingness to even try to play the game of one-upmanship (there’s no point if you know you’ll lose).

    In the same vein, the reason why you would get moneyed men with a bunch of mistresses is because they can afford them/the women have a drastically reduced income if they choose not to and Chinese lower class men don’t step up their game because they simply can’t. But go to any university in any richer city and you’ll see a bunch of guys, for the first time in their lives, trying a little harder to look cool.

  4. Hank

    -+

    If you have 5 men and 1 women in a society, your population will increase by 1.

    If you have 5 women and 1 man in your society, your population will increase by 5.

    By eliminating females in preference for boys,, China has reduced the “possibility” of increasing its population by “x” amount.

    Maybe this is also the reason why only Chinese females (not boys) are given up for foreign adoption.

    I do not know if this is a conscious decision on part of the government but the results are the same – lower population growth.

  5. -++1

    This is one of the more interesting posts I have seen in a while.

    I suppose your question about what “we” the reader notices in the “The Last Psychiatrist” quote (is that not the name of a character in a Philip K. Dick novel?) is the assumption Chinese men are not “upping” their game. Clearly, Chinese men are, actually, quite aggressively “upping the game”, buy striving to become rich. By attending and studying hard in school from a very young age. By showing off wealth where ever they can. The whole society is trying to “up the game”. And The Last Physchiatrist is making a silly assumption that sexual competition is manifested through clothes choices and sexual behavior, rather than showing wealth.

    I’m not a biologist. But to play Devil’s advocate with the bonus comment… OK. Maybe polygamy allows females access to the best genes. But it is also economically expensive because it forces females to work more, unless the man can afford multiple wives. In the Animal Kingdom, (I’m thinking of lions here). females have to do all the work and bring home the food. That means less time with the cubs. Its a trade-off… more work for access to better genes. For lions, those better genes is the primary determinant of survival. However, we humans depend on nurture at least as much as nature, so more work for better genes is usually a negative trade-off. Success in life is much more determined by how much individual attention primary caregivers can provide.

    • -+

      @Kai @Jesse On the bonus comment, I think that I agree with Jesse here. To view human biology through the single dimension of genetic superiority is, at least, to ignore the decades of socialization afterward and, at worst, to boil humanity down to questions of superior genes, which sounds too close to other arguments made by some people in Germany in the 1930s.

      Moreover, this clearly ignores the emotional preferences of women. That is, survey women to see what they think about this idea and the political (un)viability becomes a reason to let the hypothetical die where it lays. This may seem like the obvious silent factor, but it needs to be said because it would be shameful to ignore.

      Finally, on the more general issue of male behavior in China amidst a gender imbalance, has anyone looked at any scholarly work on this? I mean, anecdotes are interesting, but what are some of the more (if any) objective studies saying?

      • -+

        Note: When I say “objective”, I am not disparaging the argument here. The logic is solid, but it is mostly theoretical, while the evidence is generally anecdotal.

        Note #2: Though I am not familiar with a lot of general lifestyle research, I am more familiar with the social movement — aka contentious politics, protest, or dissent — literature. In this respect, gender adds to a pool of young males with relatively few responsibilities tying them down at home, who are theoretically more willing to take risk.

        But location and class is also critical here. The largest gender imbalances are in the rural areas. And protests there are the most dispersed/least organized (on a widespread level) among various types in China. Among more urban, middle/upper class single men, it’s hard to know if they would be galvanized to face the gov’t in any significantly massive way. Perhaps in the face of economic catastrophe.

        Anyway, like I said, I’m not as familiar with gender imbalances among various segments in China. And in the context of contentious politics, this would be important to know.

        None of this gets at the lifestyle questions above. But I thought it might be slightly related, at least.

    • -++2

      Jesse,

      And The Last Physchiatrist is making a silly assumption that sexual competition is manifested through clothes choices and sexual behavior, rather than showing wealth.

      Not sure he’s doing that. I think that was just him describing the earlier scenario with black women and am pretty sure he, of all people, know that men rely on wealth as a proxy for reproductive viability.

  6. Jones

    -++2

    Obviously Chinese men need to start getting interested in their chocolate sisters.

  7. Christine

    -++4

    Thanks for putting up this post :)

    Note that the conclusion about gender imbalance and marriage priority among the black population is a corollary of some key background statistics in the original study: 1) 96% of black women marry black men, 2) 70% of black babies are born out of wedlock, and 3) 1/3 of black women between the age of 30-44 are married.

    Women outnumber men in the black community alone does not result in a redefinition of marriage preference and certainly does not re-affirm the evolutionary theory of polygyny. The lopsided gender pool only affects the marriage pattern when it is coupled with a demonstrable trend of racial endogamy (statistic #1) and female desperation (statistics #2 and maybe #3).

    I scorn the original study in many aspects: the problem of commodifying and economizing one of the oldest patterns of human interaction, the problem of prioritizing quantity over quality of male supply, the problem of ignoring female agency in making relationship decisions.

    That said, I’m intrigued by the brain exercise proposed by the Last Psychiatrist. Does the reverse trend in the Chinese case (actually the reverse pattern is only true in mainland China, HK women are not doing any better than their chocolate sisters, see http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/IH09Ad02.html) lead to the recommendation that Chinese men need to up their games? I think the correlation is only plausible with the backup of the necessary background statistics. Chinese women are more marketable by the virtue of the iron law of demand&supply (btw, irk!), but does it necessarily mean they are more favorable? It depends on 1) is racial endogamy as prevalent among the Chinese population as among the black? 2) how desperate are Chinese men to get laid/married? and of course 3) cultural perspectives and normative values attached to the social institution of marriage and dating.

    As you can see, it is much more difficult to ascertain the causal relationship in the Chinese episode, even if we just follow the mechanics of the original study. Male desperation is not as easy to verify as female desperation (e.g. babies born out of wedlock). Shanghainese men cook for their gf/wife, well, but they also cook for their daughters and/or mothers right? It is not an exclusive behavior correlative to marriage attributes.

    Anyway, it’s interesting to see the reactions here. While the original study is flawed in many accounts, and the assumption of the reverse pattern in China is untenable either, people tend to make the game easier for Chinese men by either encouraging Chinese men to date the surplus black women or returning to polygyny in the despotic eras. Entrenched cultural expectation trumps economic rationality….

  8. TheBigDoor

    -+

    This will only be a problem in the rural areas. A simple search online can give results about kidnapping and “buying” women to fill the gap in these areas. Chinese who live in a city have to play by the same rules as everyone else in the world. You up your game through education and later by landing a good job to attract the best possible mate. Granted, a select few can skate by on looks alone but the majority have to put in the work.

    As a side-note, and I think I much more interesting topic, I’ve heard a statement from both Chinese men and women that I always found interesting.
    I’ll paraphrase here but the just is……..
    “It sucks being a Chinese boyfriend, but it’s great being a Chinese husband.”

    Especially for urban areas, it almost seems like we are living in a Chinese version of “Mad Men”. So the question becomes; What happens to the above phrase when the late 1960 – early 1970′s (of the West) hit China? And is that change taking place already?

    • -++2

      Not really sure I agree with that statement but I live in bizarro mirror universe world so…

      At the risk of trotting out the cliche, I think that statement is simply riding on the premise that a wife usually being economically dependent upon her husband and the social stigma of losing that marriage. It’s the asymmetry of dependence and consequences that applies far less to the male.

    • Inst

      -+

      Are you guys also familiar with the hypothesis that China’s abnormally high savings rate is tied to skewed-sex ratios?

      • Sam

        -+

        Actually I can argue exact the opposite, that the rise of the housing price put more pressure on the boy-only families to grab an apartment before it’s too late. Isn’t it true that based on the old way of thinking, family dwelling is the responsibility of the groom? People save for a reason and the savings will eventually be converted to consumptions.

  9. yangrouchuan

    -++3

    The previous issue of The Economist had a full length report on the many, many, many lonely men in China and India.

    And it is the lowest end of the social/economic/educational ladder that suffer the most, and will be the first to lash out. First against foreigners and second against well off Chinese who are “hoarding more than their share”. The women have all of the power unfortunately no legal protection from being traded like commodities, especially if they themselves aren’t accomplished or at least living in a top 5 city to catch a yuppie’s eye.

    • -++3

      Indeed. I look forward to a second Boxer Rebellion sparked by too many foreigners dating Chinese ladies.

      And by “look forward to”, I mean “I’m taking my fiancee and getting the heck out of dodge before I get my skull beaten in”

      • friendo

        (click to show comment)

        • Josh

          -+

          You’ve got to be joking to be using rhetoric like this. Poach? “Pussy out”? What, from being beaten/killed? I’d rather live with a bit of shame from “pussying out” than not be living at all.

          Honestly, attitudes like yours aren’t so much insulting to me as they are to people like wife who married me because I’m a good man. Even her parents are excited to have me as part of their family and sometimes try to teach me 河南话.

          But just so we’re clear, I invite you to have your pick of any white woman you want, and I promise I couldn’t give a shit.

          • friendo

            -+

            Though I’m sure if they created a system of world racism where they simply get free shit for being born a part of a privileged race, and owned slaves for generations, things might be different.

        • Jones

          -+

          Poaching? So are you claiming them all to belong to you? Combating what you call “racism” with a bit of chauvinism, eh? Friendo, I have to hand it to you. You have enormous balls. Too bad they won’t go to any use since we’re successfully poaching all of your virgins.

          And “pussy out once again”? Pretty sure the poachers dominated the last Boxer Rebellion. Dan Daly, for example.

          You seriously need to relax and stop being so damn sensitive. It’s like China just gained one more woman.

          • friendo

            -+-2

            No, they are part of China- just as the men are. I don’t believe Chinese men should go to a) minority areas or b) Southeast Asia for brides either. If they can’t find a wife, tough. No need to be pathetic and go looking in the countryside for a bride when you could obviously never compete in “fitness”.

            Pretty sure the poachers dominated the last Boxer Rebellion.

            You mean killed civilians, after a long history of killing civilians. Sure, that’s not going to happen again. Try it and get nuked.

            You seriously need to relax and stop being so damn sensitive. It’s like China just gained one more woman.

            So now you’re disparaging women, what a “Western gentleman”. I’m not the one being sensitive, poaching women from developing countries is the ultimate loser move. Looks like this touches a nerve with you, why is this?

          • Jones

            -++1

            They’re part of the world, just like the rest of us are. They have a right to choose who they want without jealous guys like you getting your panties in a wad if they date a white guy. And you were calling Custer “racist”.

            Boxer Rebellion involved indiscriminate targeting of foreign nationals in China. It was then backed by the Chinese government. A coalition of nations got tired of it and put a stop to it. Go read a book. And China isn’t going to nuke the US, tough guy.

            “So now you’re disparaging women, what a “Western gentleman”. I’m not the one being sensitive, poaching women from developing countries is the ultimate loser move. Looks like this touches a nerve with you, why is this?”

            Haha, no champ, I’m just disparaging you. It’s funny how you were bleating earlier because Custer has a Chinese fiance, crying foul, saying it was because he’s racist and “white privilege”, etc, and then you’re saying you’re “touching a nerve”. If you have a girlfriend right now, Friendo, you shouldn’t worry too much about what other girls are doing. If you don’t, then you need to up your game and steal Custer’s woman from him. You can’t blame others for who they date, and especially can’t tell them who they should date. Because you’re just Friendo. You’re not anyone in any position to put limitations on such a huge population of women. Seriously. You’re just Friendo. The problem lies in you, not in the women.

          • friendo

            -+

            They’re part of the world

            So is your bank account, so if you don’t mind I’ll just be here helping myself. You’re welcome comrade.

            They have a right to choose who they want without jealous guys like you getting your panties in a wad if they date a white guy.

            Nice try at deflecting the fact that you couldn’t find a real woman in America, so you had to dig China’s dregs to find a woman. Is that what you’re saying? Trust me, I’m not jealous. If someone shits on my lawn jealously doesn’t quite describe the sensation.

            Admittedly there is some profound symmetry in these couples though. Lanky, awkward, weak white males and squat, dark, uh shall we say… uncultured… peasants from the Southeast Asian border on their arms.

            Still a loser move on both sides. If you don’t like it what can I say, it’s just the truth.

            Boxer Rebellion involved indiscriminate targeting of foreign nationals in China. It was then backed by the Chinese government. A coalition of nations got tired of it and put a stop to it. Go read a book. And China isn’t going to nuke the US, tough guy.

            Boxer Rebellion involved reaction to foreigners indiscriminately attacking non-whites. This was backed by white governments. A coalition of Chinese peoples got tired of it and tried to put a stop to it. Go read a book. And the US isn’t going to “put them Chineeses in thems place” with their seven best buddies, tough guy.

            Custer has a Chinese fiance, crying foul, saying it was because he’s racist and “white privilege

            I was being polite. Saying “you’re a nerd who needs to go to poverty stricken villages to find a girl” is pretty harsh, don’t you think? What is with the vicarious butthurt?

            If you have a girlfriend right now, Friendo, you shouldn’t worry too much about what other girls are doing.

            Not interested.

            If you don’t, then you need to up your game and steal Custer’s woman from him.

            No thank you! Just get her out of China. The problem is we’ll have to deal with the lowest 5% of males that she would have been dating otherwise in China.

            You can’t blame others for who they date, and especially can’t tell them who they should date.

            Yes, we can. The white media has no problem spending billions of dollars slandering “Asian” males and pushing the “white is right” idea into minds all over the world. It has no problem putting 99% of Asian females on the screen with white male romantic partners. The KKK has no problem targeting interracial couples. White families have no problem pressuring their daughters to date in their race.

            You have no issue with any of these actions, so why can’t the Chinese use any of these same measures with you? Only it’ll be with standard Chinese thoroughness and scale.

            You’re not anyone in any position to put limitations on such a huge population of women. Seriously. You’re just Friendo. The problem lies in you, not in the women.

            You’re assuming it’s just me. You’re also assuming proper Chinese women aren’t disgusted by the sickening whoring out of classless women- they are. They don’t appreciate all the nasty drooling stares they get from white men either.

          • Jones

            -+

            “So is your bank account, so if you don’t mind I’ll just be here helping myself. You’re welcome comrade.”
            Wow, you’re hurting for logic and examples. My bank account is private property. Human beings are not. Sorry, you lose.

            “Nice try at deflecting the fact that you couldn’t find a real woman in America, so you had to dig China’s dregs to find a woman. Is that what you’re saying? Trust me, I’m not jealous. If someone shits on my lawn jealously doesn’t quite describe the sensation.”

            My girlfriend isn’t even Chinese, dude. You’re jealous, it’s obvious because of how much of a hissy fit you throw whenever someone mentions having a Chinese girlfriend.

            “Boxer Rebellion involved reaction to foreigners indiscriminately attacking non-whites. This was backed by white governments. A coalition of Chinese peoples got tired of it and tried to put a stop to it. Go read a book. And the US isn’t going to “put them Chineeses in thems place” with their seven best buddies, tough guy.”

            So the Chinese attacked missionaries and Chinese Christians? Excellent, on topic reaction on their part.

            “I was being polite. Saying “you’re a nerd who needs to go to poverty stricken villages to find a girl” is pretty harsh, don’t you think? What is with the vicarious butthurt?”

            Vicarious butthurt? Again, need I remind you who said “I hate people like you” randomly when Custer was joking? Cry us a river.

            “No thank you! Just get her out of China. The problem is we’ll have to deal with the lowest 5% of males that she would have been dating otherwise in China.”

            That’s their problem. Should’ve stepped up their game.

            “Yes, we can. The white media has no problem spending billions of dollars slandering “Asian” males and pushing the “white is right” idea into minds all over the world. It has no problem putting 99% of Asian females on the screen with white male romantic partners. The KKK has no problem targeting interracial couples. White families have no problem pressuring their daughters to date in their race.”

            Ok, so, it;s another conspiracy? Everything is a conspiracy against poor ol’ Friendo. Always out to get Friendo and take his virgins. All the types of media in the west decided to get together and turn against Friendo. Perhaps if you weren’t wearing such a chip on your shoulder, you’d find a girl.

            “You have no issue with any of these actions, so why can’t the Chinese use any of these same measures with you? Only it’ll be with standard Chinese thoroughness and scale.”

            I actually haven’t noticed those “actions” taking place. They’re non-existent. Why should anything that exists solely in your mind concern me?

            “You’re assuming it’s just me. You’re also assuming proper Chinese women aren’t disgusted by the sickening whoring out of classless women- they are. They don’t appreciate all the nasty drooling stares they get from white men either.”

            Yeah, I know you’re one of those guys that sits and stares at the white guy/asian girl couples on the street with that disgusted look on your face. Talking under your breath and calling her bad names, but never confronting them in person. Probably call her a “traitor”, and if the guy and girl overhear you, they laugh at you and you don’t do anything about it. Yeah, you’re not the only one for sure.

            Enjoy your life of anger and loneliness, crybaby.

        • Henry

          -+

          Point taken, Friendo, white privilege and racism are alive and well. Studies have shown discrimination against Asian American males and Black women on dating websites, and this is controlling for intervening variables. But there are many kinds of privilege, such as class, gender and citizenship, and everyone takes advantage of their privilege in some way. If you have access to a computer, are a man, speak English, and aren’t going hungry then you are certainly privileged. So I understand your anger, but I think it’s self-righteous that you don’t acknowledge your own privilege.

          Also, thank you for giving yourself the name Friendo, which automatically makes everyone who speaks to you sound passive aggressive ; )

          • friendo

            -+-3

            I’m also utterly disgusted by Taiwanese, Hong Konger, ABC, CBC whatever you want to call em “men” going to poor rural villages and taking brides (more like a third or fourth mistress) from there. They make me want to puke.

          • Jones

            -++1

            So, wait, is this about white privileged and racism, or just your own extreme butthurt nationalism? Earlier they wanted guys because they’re white, but now it’s the other Asians? Get a hold of yourself, man.

          • friendo

            -+-1

            I’m not a mainlander myself. They don’t “want” whites btw, they want their money or a greencard- usually the ugly ones do.

            Still grosses me out seeing ugly ass losers from rich cities, or CCP princelings, or whatever have you poaching rural women.

            Makes me puke seeing Chinese men with Southeast Asian women too.

      • Josh

        -+

        That’s my plan for the summer.

  10. friendo

    -+

    situation in China where men are slated to outnumber women by 30-35 million in 20203.

    Assuming anyone is dumb enough to believe that all 1.3+ billion people in China were counting. There are undoubtedly tens of millions more people who are not taken into account.

    That, and a huge minority of men never marry. This is because some women would rather be mistresses, as the guy mentioned.

    Bin Wang. Haircuts and purses…..seriously. I look forward to the day when young Chinese males indulge in a bit of cross-dressing and make-up before they seriously enter the business end of life, the employment/apartment/marriage market in a white shirt and black office pants. And this is coming from someone who is a senior citizen.

    Rarely see it from men outside of Shanghai/Coastal South.

  11. -++2

    Nice one Kai.

    Somehow I don’t see the guys in Shanghai upping their game. The ladies control our destinies, we just shut up and stand by for orders.

    God save iu from the Shanghai gals.

  12. Henry

    -++4

    Asian men, in China or otherwise, have an important advantage: they are MEN. As they get older, they can date a wider pool of women (up to a certain age of course). It is much harder for a women to date someone younger than her, and oftentimes women don’t want to date a younger man anyway. Men, on the other hand, can wait until they have a large pool of available women and can wait until their salary is large enough to attract more women. So what we will see in China is older men poaching younger women. Chinese men will still get married, but on average they will get married at an older age than Chinese women do. Thus, the inequality COULD be born out by having to wait, not by staying single forever.

    I’d also be interested in seeing if there is the same effect on Asian American males since several studies of dating websites have shown that Asian men and Black women are the least preferred, overall. That isn’t to say that some Asian men are very popular with non-Asian ladies, though. I’ve seen a lot of Asian male/White female couples in Hawaii and Orange County. Again, cultural norms are key. But the long and short of it is that because of GENDER, Black women have a much harder time finding partners than Asian men. It’s still great to be a man.

    • friendo

      -+-2

      Older men will still have limp dicks, smell funny and be half balding though. No young woman worth half a shit would really devote herself to some old perv.

      • Inst

        -+

        i fixed your nick, it should be trollo.

        I agree strongly with Henry regarding the infinite hotel solution; at the very least, with this incident we should get some nice data on how much age differences can buffer gender disparity (eventually you’ll get 80-year-old men marrying 12-year-old girls, but the sheer grossness of such a coupling would put the maximum buffer size to at most 15-70).

        • -++1

          See, this is why these discussion sections are critical. The variable that all sociologists forget to include in future demographic trends: the grossness factor.

          Thanks, Inst.

          • Inst

            -++1

            iirc, classical greeks tended to have at least a 10 year age disparity between brides and groom– their young men’s proper role was to be fodder as a hoplite, and their women married as soon as they were fertile.

            I mean that theoretically speaking you could have all sorts of bizarre cultural practices when the appropriate conditions form; there was gerontocide in the Celts and even in the proto-Chinese. Bisexuality was normative in upper-class classical Greek males, and there was shock at the notion of loving your wife. However, it takes times for these conditions and attitudes to form, so yeah, maybe after a long period of time 80-year-olds marrying 12-year-olds could become normative, but not immediately.

            There’s also scientific hypotheses on human longevity; the trick is that the male of the species can remain fertile long into old-age. If he can retain the stature to obtain a harem, the ability to live long and be fruitful is an evolutionary advantage, so old men having children with young wives isn’t apart from the design sheet.

          • -+

            But all of your last response is too objective, based on structural population numbers. What I am suggesting is that you have introduced an important *subjective* variable (from the perspective of the mates): grossness.

            Despite the name, I’m not being facetious. Psychologically and socially, the perception of a mate varies based on the age and age gap. We all might like to claim that love is independent of social norms, but it’s not. If 70% of those around a couple are giving “gross” cues, then that couple — especially the younger mate — would probably feel the “gross factor”.

  13. ENE

    -++2

    DIDN’T THEY BRING THIS ON THEMSELVES BY KILLING THEIR BABY GIRLS? WHICH IS THE CRUELEST THING ONE CAN IMAGIN. THIS IS A MIXUP BECAUSE THEY MIGHT HAVE THE HIGHEST NUMBER OF MEN BUT THEY ARE ALSO STILL THE WORLD BIGGEST POPULATION. IMAGINE IF THEY HAD THE SAME NUMBER OF WOMEN OR WOMEN ENOUGH TO MATCH MEN. ALREADY THEY ARE OVERPOPULATED, IF YOU ADD THE NUMBER OF THOSE MANY BABY GIRLS THEY HAVE KILLED BEFORE TO THEIR CURRENT POPULATION IT WILL BE A DISASTER. NOT THAT I KNOW MUCH BUT AS FAR AS I KNOW FAMILIES ARE RESTRICTED TO A CERTAIN NUMBER OF KIDS TO TRY EASE THIS GROWING NUMBER BUT BIG DAMAGE HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE. IT MIGHT BE A LITTLE TOO LATE TO TRY AND RECTIFY THE MATTER. HOW DID IT GET OUT OF HAND IN THE FIRST PLACE BUT I GUESS IT’S WHAT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME PEOPLE WAIT FOR THINGS TO BE OUT OF HAND. PREVENTION IS BETTER THAN CURE HAS NEVER WORKED IN SERIOUS CASES LIKE THAT ONE.